Line 6 KB37 or UX2 use with Riffworks, mixing & mastering

[kellhome]

I am looking for any help in learning how to use my new Line 6 KB37. I want to be able to use the keyboard for synthesizer and piano work, and just downloaded Bome's Mouse Keyboard to get started with Midi files. The whole process has opened a new world to me and helps with inspiration and ideas, but is a lot more complicated than I thought at first. That is the reason I picked Riff Works. I have Ableton Live light/line 6 edition since it was included free, so I am debating weather to use their program or Reason or another?! The choices are as mind boggling as the use of the programs and hardware, so anyone who wants to chime in on anything related to a program to use with Riffworks, is much appreciated! I want to keep it as simple as possible and not spend more time on the computer than necessary, and I am just doing this as a hobby and for fun (as an aging 60's guitar player). I haven't used Ableton enough to say much about it but it looks fairly complicated, so hopefully Reason is not so much that way.

One basic thing that I have a problem with is I have yet to make a whole song with Riff Works. I have lots of riffs, but yet to master and mix them down to a song. I find that I can record with RW and let the layers self create and add a number of guitar riffs in one riff file. It is the art of putting riffs together that stumps me. I got some good answers on a post called "Supid newbie questions for quick answers!", but I still have a hard time making seamless transitions from riff to riff. I don't see a lot of talk about it on the boards so I guess most everyone has figured it out in their own way, but again any input is appreciated.

I have a drum machine sufficient for my needs, so don't really need more drums in a mastering program. I have a mic as well and sometimes put it on my amp for recording. The amp has it's own Midi input outputs and a selection of fairly corny drum and base files.

Thanks

[pooterpatty]

As far as other apps to use with Riffworks, I know that others here on the board use Reason with some success, but Reason is way too complicated (and pricey) for my tastes.

As far as getting more seamless transitions between riffs, I can probably help you with that. You didn't specify what you're using to get your guitar sounds. If you're using a mic'd amp, make sure you write down the settings on your amp once you get a tone you're happy with. Make sure to write down what pickups you used on your guitar too!

Now that you know what your settings will be, here's where the magic comes in (not magic really, more of a method). It's best to try to record as many riffs as you can for a given song in just one "session". The dynamics of your playing, even the angle you hold the pick at can change from one day to the next. Try to play consistently across all of your riffs, using the same pick attack, and more importantly, the same volume. With riff-based recording programs, your timing becomes even more important. If your meter isn't dead-on, it can make the beginning and end of a riff sound "chopped off". You'll know you're doing it right when you can record a riff and play it back so it loops over and over, and you don't hear a noticeable change in the guitar sound at the beginning and the end. I may have to record a guitar part 30 times before I get it just right.

Sometimes even when your meter is dead-on, you can still notice a difference between riffs. I like to use Riffworks' built-in effects (like delay and reverb) to smooth out the edges. If you record a guitar track on one riff and add some RW delay to it, the "decay" will carry over to the next riff. If, instead, you added delay on your amp, the decay will NOT carry over. It's best to record as dry as possible anyway, and add effects to taste later.

We all suffer from writer's block every now and then (the Junkies have even written songs about it in an attempt to conquer it!), but one thing you might do to help you take your riffs and make a coherent song out of them is to study the composition of some of your favorite songs by other artists. Most rock songs use a standard formula: verse/verse/chorus/verse/verse/chorus/solo/bridge/chorus, etc.

[rhynoclemmis]

Hi Kellhome,

I won't delve into song-writing now, as there are most likely 1.000+ other users here who do that better than me, but try to write the song beforehand, so you can work out the transitions. A good option in Riffworks is to use another Riff as lead-in to the one you actually want to record, so you can play the prior riff along and start into the new one "coming from the one before". Pfff... I'd have problems uttering that in Austrian, let alone English. Anyway, don't forget to delete the residue riff you've recorded into "the riff before", as using this option will record a layer into the riff used as lead-in as well.
EDIT: that lead-in Riff can be used perfectly to record fade-outs of guitars. I found that fade-outs made afterwards in a different recording session simply sound bad.

To keep things as simple as possible I'd leave out as many programs as possible. I've never recorded a keyboard (yet, next weekend's the premiere) but you can do pretty much everything in Riffworks if you don't want to do any real professional stuff. I've been trying to get into Reason, Cubase and whatever other programs for years now and found Riffworks the only option if you don't want to read a 1000-page handbook where you understand only half.

To keep things as simple as possible I personally wouldn't even use an amp, except when you're recording an accoustic guitar or other musical instrument. The Gearbox program that comes with the Line 6 KB37 has many amp settings that really sound great, especially when you take the time to create the sound you want. What comes out of my Toneport sounds better than what comes out of my amp, actually.

[blue4u]

We all suffer from writer's block every now and then (the Junkies have even written songs about it in an attempt to conquer it!), but one thing you might do to help you take your riffs and make a coherent song out of them is to study the composition of some of your favorite songs by other artists. Most rock songs use a standard formula: verse/verse/chorus/verse/verse/chorus/solo/bridge/chorus, etc.

Excellent advise from Pooter here!! We had an interesting discussion about these sorts of things a long while back. You may find it helpful: http://www.sonomawireworks.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=4049

BTW, I don't think you'll find Reason any less complicated than Ableton Live. It may be even harder! Also, everyone here has felt much of what you're going through now. It's a constant tug o' war. Some songs (at least for me) are just not finish-able. I may come back later or just have to let them go. To Pooter's point, if I can't nail the basic structure of the entire tune within a couple of hours I usually dump it and try again with a new song. Maybe I'll come back to it but usually I won't. It's almost like we have to sift through the crap to pull out the jewels. I just write out whatever is there and let it be what it is. I have substantially more incomplete works than completed but I'm pretty sure that the process of going through it has helped me in a way that nothing else could. I got lots of real sh*tty songs as proof In short, it's given me experience and a lot of hints about what NOT to do!

Writer's block is a good time to go back to those unfinished pieces and see if I can drum up the inspiration to finish them or even use those pieces as new inspiration. As Pooter said though, you may have to re-record the parts because the sounds will likely be too different (even if played the same way) to match your previous recording.

It's important to try and record all of your guitar parts in one shot. Drums, effects, and the rest of it can be dealt with in pieces but guitars and vocals really need to sound fluid and consistent. The only way I know to do that is to capture the vibe from start to finish as it's going on. Even with the same settings and pickups, the same part played on Tuesday can sound way different than it did last Friday. It can be a tough thing to get around. There are exceptions to this rule though so, every situation is unique when it comes to crafting songs. Sometimes it even works to have all of the loops changing up and sounding disconnected. Well, that's conceptual and even a bit philosophical but it can fit the song. Dream Theater and Pink Floyd are a couple of bands who've mastered that art of turning on a dime within a song to shift gears and go in another direction. Usually the key thing there is to come back to the main part or motif to establish some sense of a foundation.

For me, the great paradox is that the harder I try to force these things to happen the further away I get from the desired outcome. Go figure! The book, "Effortless Mastery" (http://www.amazon.com/Effortless-Mastery-Liberating-Master-Musician/dp/156224003X) is an excellent read from an amazing Jazz musician. It speaks volumes about this concept.

All the best,
Rich

[blue4u]

BTW, our resident "Gator" has provided an EXCELLENT tutorial on mixing and mastering with RiffWorks. Give it a look:
https://gatorjj.wordpress.com/riffworks-mixing-overview/ - it's 5 pages

[blue4u]

A good option in Riffworks is to use another Riff as lead-in to the one you actually want to record, so you can play the prior riff along and start into the new one "coming from the one before". Pfff... I'd have problems uttering that in Austrian, let alone English. Anyway, don't forget to delete the residue riff you've recorded into "the riff before", as using this option will record a layer into the riff used as lead-in as well.
EDIT: that lead-in Riff can be used perfectly to record fade-outs of guitars. I found that fade-outs made afterwards in a different recording session simply sound bad.

Good tip