Looking at a Mac Book Pro

[garnold]

I think I'm done with Windows at this point. The plan is to pick up a 15in Mac Book Pro. The model I'm going to spec out will have the fastest chip I can put in it (3.06GHz Intel Core 2 Duo).

The only thing that concerns me is that I'm not seeing more people on this forum using a Mac. I really thought Mac's where the way to go for music and art? Is this because it comes with Garage Band so now is buying RiffWorks for it? I'd just like to hear from some people that they are happy running RiffWorks on a MacBook and which model they are using.

[Wedgebill]

Don't know anything about Macs but maybe you should check out this thread before you leap my friend

http://www.sonomawireworks.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8181

[andrik]

Hi,

I'm a happy mac user and also a Riffworks user. I run Riffworks on both a windows pc and my mac (and soon another mac). Riffworks runs fine on a mac, no problem whatsoever.

Looking at rewire, which greatly enhances the possibilities of Riffworks, the windows platforms offers a lot more choices. Fruity Loops for example isn't available for mac. The same goes for Synapse Orion, etc. But then, Reaper, Ableton Live and Reason are available.

I think for audio recording, the Mac Core drivers are better then windows based ASIO drivers. Furthermore, the VISTA platform for example is totally not suitable for making music. MacOSX is. I'm not sure how windows7 will be holding up. And there are currently some issues with Snow Leopard and Riffworks, which have to be resolved in Riffworks, but that's being taking care of.

So Mac or Windows, they are both great options. (you can always buy the mac and make a bootcamp windows installation ).

regards,
Andrik

[sick1982]

I'm even using a MacBook Core Duo (the 32bit one) 1.8GHz

But I think upgrading from 2.8GHz to 3.06GHz isn't worth the money.

I checked some benchmarks a few days ago, and it looks like it's only 5% faster or so.
In combination with the fact that most of the time your CPU will be waiting on other hardware.

IMHO such a difference is only worth the money in workstations for long running tasks like simulations, and compilations (if your disks are fast enough too), but I'm always open if someone can share their experience as a professional recorder.

[d3drocks]

dont switch. you'll be paying out the seams for dated hardware, and a brand name. basically, people use macs more the way women use handbags: as a fasion statement. I see people sitting in tacky cafe's all the time fiddeling with their macbooks, looking up every once and a while to see if people are watching them, and taking pride if they are being watched. its really quite comical.

also, what you dont know is, apple took the source code to the BSD operating system, and just put their own graphics on top of it. in other words, your paying for software that was cost free in the first place www.freebsd.org http://www.pcbsd.org/ http://www.gnu-darwin.org/

apple also charges alot for a yearly system upgrade (the equivilant are the FREE service packs in windows), which cause all sorts of software and hardware incompatibilities. people say windows is bad for compatibility, but macs are worse.

[andrik]

d3drock,

You know your answer calls for a reply. I'm sure you don't have a mac, or you wouldn't post such a reply. I own both a macbook (1 year) and a windows machine. Of course I've been using windows all my life like everybody else. I bought a mac after seeing a collegue of mine really enjoying working with it. Things which were complex on a pc were easy on a mac. Now you do pay a price for this, because on a mac it's more difficult to do something lowlevel.

anyway, looking at your arguments...
so what if macosx is based on Unix? Who cares? It's stable! Something which can't be said about windows. I use a macbook 8 hours a day, for a year now, not once did it crash and no BSOD's. I'm happy to pay for that and the great user interface.

You say the hardware is dated. How so? The new macbook uses a specially designed grahipcs card. The memory is 1066 DDR3 with a max of 8Gb in a macbookpro! What's old about that? The rest of the hardware is intel based and up to date.

You say mac users pay a LOT for updates which would be a service pack for pc users? True I paid 29 dollars for going from Leopard to Snow Leopard. All other patches are free. Now is the 29 dollars really going to stop anybody from buying a mac? You call 29 dollars a lot?
I believe you pay more or the same for upgrading to a new release in windows and macosx.

Look I love macs as much as pc's, I'm just tired of hearing people who don't use macs, flaming macs. Use it first, then judge!

Anyway, I agree that some people buy a mac just for the looks but I don't think anybody stops and turn their heads for mac anymore, we're past that point.
What still remains a big issue is software availability. There simply isn't as much software for mac as there is for pc. I use my mac for my work (Oracle IT Consultant) and private to make music on the road...(you can't beat the battery power (8 hours!) of a macbook pro).

So why did I buy a mac?
- It's intel based nowadays.
- Great stability, no bloatware.
- Software for mac is generally very good and easy to use.
- Windows Software which I can't run, I do run with parallels desktop (it rules in coherence mode).
- great ergonomics.

So why not to buy a mac?
- the mac itself is more expensive.
- not as much software as for pc (but thenagain you can use parallels or bootcamp).

[sick1982]

It's clear that d3drocks doesn't know what he is talking about and actually never owned or really used a mac.

Every OS update include a whole lot more features than they are bragging about. And upgrading from Leopard to Snow Leopard is like 29$.

Apple didn't just take the BSD sources. The xnu kernel is based on both FreeBSD 5.0 and the Mach kernel, both being very high quality code. And tbh, it's more Mach than it is BSD and there is a LOT of work involved in making the architecture work as it is. It's actually more an up-to-date version of NeXTSTEP which was based on BSD 4.2 or so and Mach. On top of that they included a complex and powerfull gfx layer not found on ANY free or even payed UNIX system.

And why rewrite perfectly good network code if it is already available? Even windows its TCP/IP stack contains tons of BSD code...

But whatever, it comes down to what you think that works best for you.

[d3drocks]

It's clear that d3drocks doesn't know what he is talking about and actually never owned or really used a mac.

Every OS update include a whole lot more features than they are bragging about. And upgrading from Leopard to Snow Leopard is like 29$.

Apple didn't just take the BSD sources. The xnu kernel is based on both FreeBSD 5.0 and the Mach kernel, both being very high quality code. And tbh, it's more Mach than it is BSD and there is a LOT of work involved in making the architecture work as it is. It's actually more an up-to-date version of NeXTSTEP which was based on BSD 4.2 or so and Mach. On top of that they included a complex and powerfull gfx layer not found on ANY free or even payed UNIX system.

And why rewrite perfectly good network code if it is already available? Even windows its TCP/IP stack contains tons of BSD code...

But whatever, it comes down to what you think that works best for you.

hhahahha, I've owned macs before. I threw them ALL out (except the ones os 8 and under). and I know the code is released under a gentle Open Source license. thing is, apple never donated anything back to that community, and you HAVE to admit that it is COMPLETELY restrictive of apple to limit to their hardware only (they are in a lawsuit over this). if u look at windows (even if its only from an audio perspective), SOOOOO much more is availible for windows. there is actually more free software availible for windows, then there is in total for OSX.
it isnt denyible as well that the (bigger chunk) of the crowd of apple users use their macs more as a peice of stylish clothing then a computer.

if you want to talk kernels, why the HELL does apple cover up a kernel panic with an image file? a kernel panic outputs alot of important stuff as to why the system crashed, which may lead to ways to fix it.
(being a long time linux user, ive noticed that when u get a kernel panic, more times then not, you cant boot properly without doing work on the system).

d3drocks,

You know your answer calls for a reply. I'm sure you don't have a mac, or you wouldn't post such a reply. I own both a macbook (1 year) and a windows machine. Of course I've been using windows all my life like everybody else. I bought a mac after seeing a collegue of mine really enjoying working with it. Things which were complex on a pc were easy on a mac. Now you do pay a price for this, because on a mac it's more difficult to do something lowlevel.

anyway, looking at your arguments...
so what if macosx is based on Unix? Who cares? It's stable! Something which can't be said about windows. I use a macbook 8 hours a day, for a year now, not once did it crash and no BSOD's. I'm happy to pay for that and the great user interface.

You say the hardware is dated. How so? The new macbook uses a specially designed grahipcs card. The memory is 1066 DDR3 with a max of 8Gb in a macbookpro! What's old about that? The rest of the hardware is intel based and up to date.

You say mac users pay a LOT for updates which would be a service pack for pc users? True I paid 29 dollars for going from Leopard to Snow Leopard. All other patches are free. Now is the 29 dollars really going to stop anybody from buying a mac? You call 29 dollars a lot?
I believe you pay more or the same for upgrading to a new release in windows and macosx.

Look I love macs as much as pc's, I'm just tired of hearing people who don't use macs, flaming macs. Use it first, then judge!

Anyway, I agree that some people buy a mac just for the looks but I don't think anybody stops and turn their heads for mac anymore, we're past that point.
What still remains a big issue is software availability. There simply isn't as much software for mac as there is for pc. I use my mac for my work (Oracle IT Consultant) and private to make music on the road...(you can't beat the battery power (8 hours!) of a macbook pro).

So why did I buy a mac?
- It's intel based nowadays.
- Great stability, no bloatware.
- Software for mac is generally very good and easy to use.
- Windows Software which I can't run, I do run with parallels desktop (it rules in coherence mode).
- great ergonomics.

So why not to buy a mac?
- the mac itself is more expensive.
- not as much software as for pc (but thenagain you can use parallels or bootcamp).

I like this, as u are looking at it in a fairly unbiased way.
I was also forced to use a mac for video editing in school (I'll give macs that, they have a good tool for video editing) but they were CONSTANTLY crashing. now, these were new systems, right out of the box, donated by the RCMP to the school I was at, to do anti-drug videos. I used every mac there, with final cut pro, and not 1 didnt crash every 25 minutes or so. this has only added to my dislike for macs, as it completely affected school marks (and the marks of everyone else). I ended up bringing the videos home, and with a combination of Blender and Pinnicle studio, I finished the video I had to, without 1 crash, BSOD, etc on my vista 64 machine.
also, I find the mac ads on TV very annoying, as they point out flaws that macs have in common with windows, such as compatibility. riffworks has had issues on the new installment of the mac os, has it not?
going from XP to vista, just about all of my apps worked flawlessly (minus the few 16 bit apps I was still using), and when I beta'd windows 7, all of my apps worked again (including drivers). I dont think macs are having that kind of compatibility.

anyways, if the OP absolutely NEEDs to get a mac, you can intergrade windows right into it with virtualbox, creating a seamless desktop.

[jamwerx]

@d3drocks

Ya know dude.. sometimes it's best to just keep your mouth shut to prevent your ignorance from spewing out of your mouth for the world to see and hear and you end up just standing there d*ck in hand looking like a complete dumb*ss which in this case you have certainly already achieved.

You need to accept the fact that people are going tired of the subpar products they get with windows and that isn't for you to decide on whether or not they are justifie in doing so. Plain and simple people are sick of m$ and they seek alternative avenues to get their needs met. There sure is a lot of people figuring out that macs offer a superior product and experience and they are willing to pay for it. I had a friend bitching at me the last 4 yrs about how great pc's are and blah blah blah & 6 months ago or so a job he was started provided a new macbook pro for him and his comments are like so "I was wrong.... clearing...I liken my macbook pro to a lexus where as my pc was more like a ford. I thought it was all hype and you were nuts but I surely see what the big deal is now".

That's pretty common place these days. Not to meantion windows is hell bent of copying a mac now so it just goes to show.

Personally, I am 2x as productive on a mac with my work which means I make 2x as much $$.. it's a no brainer & I gladly hand over my $$ every year for my new shiny mbp.

[d3drocks]

@d3drocks

Ya know dude.. sometimes it's best to just keep your mouth shut to prevent your ignorance from spewing out of your mouth for the world to see and hear and you end up just standing there d*ck in hand looking like a complete dumb*ss which in this case you have certainly already achieved.

You need to accept the fact that people are going tired of the subpar products they get with windows and that isn't for you to decide on whether or not they are justifie in doing so. Plain and simple people are sick of m$ and they seek alternative avenues to get their needs met. There sure is a lot of people figuring out that macs offer a superior product and experience and they are willing to pay for it. I had a friend bitching at me the last 4 yrs about how great pc's are and blah blah blah & 6 months ago or so a job he was started provided a new macbook pro for him and his comments are like so "I was wrong.... clearing...I liken my macbook pro to a lexus where as my pc was more like a ford. I thought it was all hype and you were nuts but I surely see what the big deal is now".

That's pretty common place these days. Not to meantion windows is hell bent of copying a mac now so it just goes to show.

Personally, I am 2x as productive on a mac with my work which means I make 2x as much $$.. it's a no brainer & I gladly hand over my $$ every year for my new shiny mbp.

wow, someone follows the idea of "do as I say, not as I do" a little too much. you are truely a moron. you really proved your point there.... you stated NO facts on why mac is better (ill admit a few, as I did in the above post) but damn, you really know nothing. your proving my point with your posts, in that apple has suceeded in making a religion, and a cult following. people who are willing to defend their inanimate objects, even when their facts arnt strate. next time, grab a brain, sober up, and get some facts out. I didnt respond harshly to the other guys, because they made some valid arguements, but you, you are an idiot.


there are BETTER alternatives the the garbage that apple puts out. Linux, BSD, HURD, Solaris, are just a few alternatives, that are cost free, and have the actual #1 in customer satisfaction and support. why? because it is community developed. they even go as far as to mail you the install disk for free. www.ubuntu.com check it out. OSX is bleep compared to it. it is also compatible with windows applications.
apple also has a business model that is GOING to fail. notice how you can install windows on mac hardware? do you have windows bootcamped? that means microsoft really isnt loosing, apple is. they cant get a good grip on the market, because you cannot install OSX on non apple hardware. microsoft knew this waaay back with dos, and they won the market share for a reason. if you have a universially installible OS (which microsoft does), you are going to do BETTER.
you probably think taht windows systems all crash, and get BSODs all the time. if you say you have had that experiance before, you are 1 of 2 things. a LIAR, or an inexperianced computer user. my system NEVER has crashes that bring down the system, and NEVER has BSODs. why? I have some common sense, and I know what im doing. I dont randomly delete stuff, and I certanly dont download from unsafe sources. I infact have never had a virus on this machine.

security: it has been a proven fact, that as more users move to apple systems, that the amount of viruses out there will go up as wel. what does apple offor for security? not much. since the kernel source code is freely availible, anyone with some programming skills and computer knowledge can find all sorts of back ways into your system, and do some massive damage.

now, I've just given u some facts. I wonder, can u understand it, or do u have to restart your tiney iBrain?

[EvanBerard]

I smell an OS war... :rolleyes:

[d3drocks]

I smell an OS war... :rolleyes:

probably right. it all starts when they like ot make it personal

[jamwerx]

d3drocks

You do realize that all you are doing is showing what a dillhole you are, how many times do you need to be bitch whipped before you go away?

" you stated NO facts on why mac is better"
Why would I need to? I stated the only fact that matters and that a mac is better for me, I don't care if you think this or that is better or not, it's a personal choice.

Here is a fact for you: windows use is dropping fast, mac use is rising fast. Now it doesn't take a pc user to be able to figure that one out. I'm a developer who spends 12-18hrs a day on a damn computer, I been on a mac for 5 yrs and it is the best thing I have ever done, I don't lose data anymore to system crashes, I don't waste my time cleaning & disinfection my system.. I get more done, I make more money on my mac, I enjoy working on my mac where as I dreaded working on my pc. It's a no brainer for those of us who have brains.

'you really know nothing."
Would you like to go head to head because I would destroy you.. what are you like 14? That seems about your level of competence , just the fact that you feel you must troll on a mac ? to "enlighten" the world of how "great" a pc is lol

"in that apple has suceeded in making a religion, and a cult following. people who are willing to defend their inanimate objects, even when their facts arnt strate."
Would you mind trying to actually misspell just a few more words? I mean I misspell but you are a poster child for why windows users should be required to wear a helmet at all times.
Yes by making good quality products that people value, just the same as people value paying extra for a lexus or bmw because they value the experience it gives them. You notice how the only computer company really making $$ right is Apple... Do you realize that Apple will soon pass m$ in profit. Do you realize while m$ is laying off people and cutting products and services like crazy and they still came in at almost 20% losses is profit last year while Apple was up like 30%. Since I doubt you can figure out that profit swing it's around 50% difference.

"sober up, and get some facts out."
I can bury your dumbass in facts if you prefer a good ole fashion public beat down I surely don't mind giving it. All your "facts" are nothing more than personal opinions that you seem to think are actually accurate.

You can call me an idiot all you want... if that makes you feel better about yourself... the rest of us are laughin are arses of at the f at how completely retarded you are.

"because they made some valid arguements, "
Do you want to try that sentence again? maybe in english? I made the only point that mattered. I have had enough battles with people over the years about this to know that people like you just won't ever get it and that is fine, you guys make great dishwashers.

"there are BETTER alternatives the the garbage that apple puts out."
Hummmmm, boy that's a GREAT FACT you got going there, sounds more like a diluted personal opinion of a jr kid who's parents won't buy him a mac so instead he trolls around spewing ignorance to make himself feel better.


"Linux, BSD, HURD, Solaris, are just a few alternatives, "

Linux isn't ready for the everyday average user to just step in and run, you surely can't load it up and hand it to your mom or grandma and expect them to be able to use it. Linux is a great OS no doubt but why would I want to be spending so much time trying to manually tweak every thing all the time and waste time with dev products that aren't as mature as what I get on a mac? why? so I can buy a bunch of cheap parts and build myself a crappy computer made of of crappy parts? If I wanted that I would buy a dell.

My purpose on a computer is to make money and all these "alternatives" you find so superior only hamper the speed at which I can work which means I lose money and given your arguments that the preferred outcome.. and you call me an idiot lol

"that are cost free, and have the actual #1 in customer satisfaction and support. why? because it is community developed. t"
So you judge quality based upon whether it is free or not? Let's take a plane ride and lets say the plane is going to crash and you have to bailout and by the door is a table and you can either buy a parachute made out of the best quality materials or you can have for free a parachute that is made out of whatever materials were cheaper that day, so you are saying the free one is better? You can always tell an idiot because he thinks the free things are best. Actually it is nothing more than a lack of common sense .

"they even go as far as to mail you the install disk for free. "
Who cares dude. Do I mind paying $100 for an os or a few grand for a mac every year when it makes me 150k? hell no. I averaged about 70k a yr when I was on a pc and I would gladly pay the extra for that massive jump in earnings.

When I went to the mac I didn't want to, I hated macs and didn't even want to look at one , I just wanted away from the crap that m$ produces so I went with linux. It was a joke, really it was a joke, they make great servers but not development machines unless you like sitting their tweaking every time you need to do something different.

"check it out. OSX is bleep compared to it"
Been there, done that and for my usage it is nothing more than a toy and IMO OS X destroys it in everyday use, not even close and don't say it is because it's not, if it was people would actually be using it.

"apple also has a business model that is GOING to fail"
Are you seriously this stupid? Seriously... you gotta be. Everyone is trying to model themselves after apple. There is absolutely no debate on how masterful Apple's business plan is. What's m$'s stock these days.. $5 or so and whats apples.. $150+. If you go and look and read the financial forcasts (ok and we all know that you don't) that there is a very clear leader going into the future and that is Apple, that's not opinion that is fact. Google and Apple are the ones raking in the cash right now and don't try and kid yourself that isn't the case because that is fact.

"do you have windows bootcamped? "
No I run vmware just to run crappy ie for testing.

"that means microsoft really isnt loosing, apple is."
LOL, you are blowing me away with knowledge here!

Actually m$ makes most of it's $$$ off of OEM deals and Office and when you put crappy winblowz on a mac m$ does make some money but not much, they would make more if those installs were on a dell. Now go look it up Apple usage and profits are sky rocketing while m$'s profits are falling so apparently your "facts" are nothing more than a delusional fantasy of yester year.

"because you cannot install OSX on non apple hardware."
Yes Einstien that is true and do you know why? Ok, I know that you really don't... Dell has already publicly stated that they would drop windows for OS X if Apple would do it but Apple won't because they don't want OS X run on crap. Apple isn't worried about market share they base their entire business upon a great user experience instead of how many can we sell. Now your less than average mind probably can't process this but why would Apple care about market share when their profits are already sky rocketing? I would go into the business plan further but let's be real here, you could understand it.

"microsoft knew this waaay back with dos, and they won the market share for a reason. if you have a universially installible OS (which microsoft does), you are going to do BETTER"
That's the dumbest thing I have ever heard lol
Now to start you do realize that even windows 1 was a copy of a mac...

And just so you know the actual reason on why m$ got market share right away (since I hate seeing you go through life not actually knowing any kind of real actual fact), m$ got the market share by buying dos (of course they didn't come up it) and licensing it on an oem deal with the pc leader at the time which was IBM. That deal ended up giving M$ the extra cash it needed to continue to rip off other systems and turn a profi and it went from there. But this crap about universal installs lol LMFAO.. seriously?????

"you probably think taht windows systems all crash, and get BSODs all the time."
Yeah and they do, I lived through it for a lot of years.

"if you say you have had that experiance before, you are 1 of 2 things. a LIAR, or an inexperianced computer user. "
So the 2 of you that have no issues over turns the millions of people who do, day in and day out. Don't try and fool anyone with that crap, we all know better, don't think we don't.

" I have some common sense,"
I got $100 that says you don't, actually you seem fairy far down the scale.. I got another $100 that says you are still a virgin who lives with his parents in their basement and has a hamster farm...

"I infact have never had a virus on this machine."
Just the other 20 you had before that and had to replace due to virus infestation! Good for you if you don't, 99.9999999% of the other windows users routinely get them.

"security: it has been a proven fact, that as more users move to apple systems, that the amount of viruses out there will go up as wel."
Let's see this proven fact.. really it's a lot of jibberish for idiot windows users who need to cry over something. You guys have been saying this for years now. Over the last 4 years the the number of mac users has more than doubled and by your logic so should the number of viruses and how is that working out for you? Lets see.. the # of actual OS X viruses for the entire linetime os OS X is.... one.. yup... one, compared to windows 70,000+.

Don't try and use that argument, it is tired an old and yet never proven just spewed by idiots like umm.. you.

"what does apple offor for security? not much."

They apparently don't need to, that's a benefit of building the os upon a solid, secure foundation of unix which by design was built for security. Now the winblowz kernal on the other hand was not built for security and still remains swiss cheese today. You can't change the facts no matter how hard you wish it, so why try.. give it up before you pull something.

" not much. since the kernel source code is freely availible, anyone with some programming skills and computer knowledge can find all sorts of back ways into your system, and do some massive damage."
My god you are really this dumb? If that was the case it would be happening all the time.. ALL THE TIME!!!! and has it.. no.. of course not. Do you need some toilet paper to wipe that diarrhea off your lip? Now isn't linux, bsd and all those freely available to? So you are contradicting yourself left and right here. So which os's are considered the safest? Oh yeah all the all these open source ones, so make up your mind but don't go both ways, it just shows your lack of a basic thought process.

"now, I've just given u some facts. I"
Umm where are these facts??? I certainly didn't see any, all I saw were cliches "I can't think for myself" opinions that have been roasted over time and time again but idiots like yourself just refuse to accept facts because of your lack of more 2 brain cells.

Give some actual real & intelligent facts or just shut the hell up before you actually make yourself look dumber than you already have.. which I would think would be an impossible task but I do have faith in you that you just might be able to do it.

And quit trooling, that just makes you a loser, this user wants to move to a mac so shut it they aren't asking you why diffusional short-coming to keep them on a crappy pc.. get over it

[jamwerx]

I smell an OS war... :rolleyes:

probably right. it all starts when they like ot make it personal

Get a mac so you can have spell check... my god

[d3drocks]

blah blah blah blah blah blah [insert new age religious babble here]

I just lol'd

u took the time type all that? and u think im gunna read it. lmfao.
seriously, go outside.

what I did get out of you farting all over the page was:
"linux isnt ready for every day use"
your a moron, it is. you obvously havnt used it before. do yourself a favor and go order one of those ubuntu CDs, they dont charge a cent, even for shipping. cant hurt, can it?


you go back to your tacky coffie house now and think that people are watching u be cool for using your macbook, while drinking that $10 french vanilla coffie.

lmao thanks for the laughs.

btw, going down to the level of question ones sexual life? LMFAOOOO! and you say I look stupid? hahahahhahahaha
if thats what u need to do (make urself look like an idiot) to get your point across, be my guest. insult my sexual life, its none of your business anyways.
I cant believe how pissed off your getting over an internet argument hahahahaha.
thanks again btw, u just made my day. I havnt had a laugh like that in a long time. I appreciate it.

I smell an OS war... :rolleyes:

probably right. it all starts when they like ot make it personal

Get a mac so you can have spell check... my god

im dyslexic thanks, kiss my ass (also, its not like im writing a PHD thesus. why would I care about spelling).


EDIT: wonder if you'll like these:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loAdQV9H8z0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfp7FbsnsbU